sword carrying in public

QUESTION: Is it possible that I can by law carry a sword around in public for protection means? If so what about concealed swords? (such as cane swords)

P.S. I live in NJ US and am over 18. I know that there are permits that can let me carry a gun around and I don't really know anything about such things with swords... but logically if I can get a permit to carry around a shotgun in public I should be able to get one for swords too right?

(if the thing about where I live or that I'm over 18 is too much info please forgive me)

ANSWER: Hi there,

Well, I am no lawyer, and I do not know the specific laws of your state. But the general rule of thumb is that it isn't a good idea...

There are quite a few groups looking to ban swords, and all they need is a few incidents of people using them for self defence (or worse, offense) and they suddenly have a lot more weight to add to the argument...

A crime scene where someone has been killed by a gun is bad enough, but a sword is a lot bloodier, and using multiple cuts on an attacker may end up getting you charged with murder as prosecution could argue that you willfully tried to kill your opponent, and it isn't self defence anymore...

There is also the fact that bringing a sword to a gun fight is pretty much suicide, so if you can carry a gun for self defence, it is a better option by far - not only for your own survival, but for that for the hobby as a whole.

Take care,

- Paul

Comments for sword carrying in public

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hope this is some help
by: b&g miron

New Jersey - Code of Criminal Justice

- 2C:39-3 Prohibited Weapons and Devices...

e. Certain weapons. Any person who knowingly has in his
possession any gravity knife, switchblade knife, dagger,
dirk, stiletto, billy, blackjack, metal knuckle, sandclub,
slingshot, cestus or similar leather band studded with
metal filings or razor blades imbedded in wood, ballistic
knife, without any explainable lawful purpose, is guilty
of a crime of the fourth degree.

- 2C:39-1 h. "Gravity knife" means any knife which has a
blade which is released from the handle or sheath thereof
by the force of gravity or the application of centrifugal
force... p. "Switchblade knife" means any knife or similar
device which has blade which opens automatically by hand
pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in
the handle of the knife... u. "Ballistic knife" means any
weapon or other device capable of lethal use and which can
propel a knife blade.

- 2C:39-4. Possession of weapons for unlawful purposes...
d. Other weapons. Any person who has in his possession any
weapon, except a firearm, with a purpose to use it
unlawfully against the person or property of another is
guilty of a crime of the third degree.

- 2C:39-5. Unlawful Possession of Weapons... d. Other weapons.
Any person who knowingly has in his possession any other
weapon under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for
such lawful uses as it may have is guilty of a crime of
the fourth degree.
- - e. Firearms or other weapons in educational institutions...
(2)Any person who knowingly possesses any weapon enumerated
in paragraphs (3) and (4) of subsection r. of N.J.S.2C:39-1
or any components which can readily be assembled into a
firearm or other weapon enumerated in subsection r. of
N.J.S.2C:39-1 or any other weapon under circumstances not
manifestly appropriate for such lawful use as it may have,
while in or upon any part of the buildings or grounds of any
school, college, university or other educational institution
without the written authorization of the governing officer
of the institution is guilty of a crime of the fourth degree.

part 2 of hope this helps
by: b&g miron

- 2C:39-6. f. Nothing in subsections b., c. and d. of N.J.S.2C:39-5
shall be construed to prevent... (2) A person carrying a firearm
or knife in the woods or fields or upon the waters of this State
for the purpose of hunting, target practice or fishing, provided
that the firearm or knife is legal and appropriate for hunting
or fishing purposes in this State and he has in his possession
a valid hunting license, or, with respect to fresh water fishing,
a valid fishing license;

(3) A person transporting any firearm or knife while traveling:
(a) Directly to or from any place for the purpose of hunting or
fishing, provided the person has in his possession a valid
hunting or fishing license; or

- 2C:39-9. d. Weapons. Any person who manufactures, causes to
be manufactured, transports, ships, sells or disposes of
any weapon including gravity knives, switchblade knives,
daggers, dirks, stilettos... is guilty of a crime of the
fourth degree.

- 2C:39-9.1... Any person who sells any hunting, fishing,
combat or survival knife having a blade length of five
inches or more or an overall length of 10 inches or more
to a person under 18 years of age commits a crime of the
fourth degree...

New Jersey Case Law:
- "Concealment was not a necessary element of the offense of
carrying a dangerous knife." (1973)
- "Concealment of weapon at time of incident constituted
important factor of offense of possession of dangerous
knife." (1971)

http://www.knife-expert.com

oow about this?
by: Shinta

how might the law apply to sakabatou (reverse blade swords) swords with no sharp edge or wooden swords? you can wield them proficiently without slicing anyone up so might that change anything?

Awesome idea
by: Anonymous

I think it should be Legal to carry a blade longer than a Bowie Knife IF you can conceal it. Because then its just a big F'ing knife isnt it?
(this is al personal opinion)

answer to: sword carrying in public
by: Adam Pendragon

I have been a medieval historian and sword collector for more than 30 years. I have participated in Medieval/Ren. fairs around the country for around 20 years, and to the best of my knowlege it is illegal to carry a sword, of any kind, for "protection."

And NO--to the best of my knowlage, you can't get a permit to carry one in any state. In most states, laws pertaining to swords are vague at best, except for sword canes and katanas. Until a few years ago, most Legislators never even considered creating laws specifically pertaining to swords, other than sword canes, which are concealed weapons. Over the years, however, movies like Highlander and Kill Bill made the katana very popular, especially with teens and young-twenty somethings. Unfortunately, there have been so many serious injuries accredited to them (most often teens proving their manliness and drunken collage students)in recent years, they've finally caught the Law's attention. Now, many states do address katanas specifically.

As for all other swords, the laws are usually intentionally vague, allowing the police as much discretion as possible. And rightly so.

The problem with wearing a sword for "protection" is this: just by doing so, you are telling the cops and everyone else "Stay back!" that you have every intention of USING this sword to hack someone to pieces if you feel threatened! This, in and of its self, can get you arrested for "possession of an illegal weapon", threatening someone with an illegal weapon (if a passer-by feels threatened by seeing someone with a sword); and, of course, if you're hiding it under your coat (or even if it's in plain view but not obviously recognizable, like some katanas) you can and will be arrested for "possession of a concealed weapon."

By the way, state laws don't always jive with city ordinances. Just because something's legal in your state doesn't mean it's legal in your city.

Personally, I sometimes think it would be fun to wear a sword around, but then, let's face it: Don't you really want to wear a sword around town just so everyone will think you're a badass? If you really feel the need to protect yourself by carrying something more than your fists (this has always worked well for me, and I'm over 50) why don't you just get a gun permit or take karate leasons? Better yet, why don't you just move to a safer neighborhood!

Just in case
by: steve

I am a retired police officer and live in Wyoming. I must walk with a cane due to health reasons. I have a concealed weapons permit and at times carry a pistol. I find it re-assuring to have my sword cane with me at all times even when carrying my pistol. It never hurts to have back-up. If something where to happen, I'll take my chances with the courts rather than to be killed on the street.

Carrying Swords
by: Aikidobear

Now how would thugs harass you if the law were to allow you to legally protect yourself? I find it odd that innocent tax paying citizens have to hide or conceal objects that could be used for self protection. The criminal element doesn't seem to have a problem with carrying weapons to make their job easier do they? I think a person should have all the right in the world to carry whatever they wish but if they use it to perpetrate a crime then (and only then) should they be penalized by the law. To me my life is much more valuable then some jackass judge, lawyer or useless thug so I will do whatever I have to- to protect it.

Katana laws.
by: Anonymous

What if the blade was duled to the point it could only crush instead of cut. Im with the other guy no point in using a katana to protect yourself, build muscle mass for that. Im an avid cos-player and I was wondering about a costume where the weapon ties it together.

baseball
by: Anonymous'

Personally i like to carry around a baseball in an easy to reach place you would be suprised how bad you can hurt someone when you turn your palm into a skullcrusher ..experience delivery driver in austin started carrying defense against muggers ...strangely got jumped by drunk assholes looking to start problems had the baseball on me so my employer or cops would never question intent. So the guys shove me around i had the ball out hy now the guy walks right up doesnt even see the ball slamming his forehead in ....weapon is in the intent and percieved utility of the user

Baseball
by: Anonymous

I would have never though to carry a baseball for self-defense. now that I think of it that would be very effective. I really dislike how the government creates laws in hopes of locking up malicious people but in turn they stop us from being able to defend ourselves with devises created to do so. Trying times we live in. I for one carry a concealed handgun every day so a would be attacker doesn't know I am armed... A sword is a bit harder to conceal so I think I would shy away from carrying swords for defense...

Sword for self defense and sport
by: Anonymous

Seriouly, I want to learn Kendo. When I become well rounded in it I would like to be able to have a custom blade made, and have it for self defense in my house. Also, if people can carry guns with extended clips, katanas and other like swords should not even be questioned if they can be used for self defense.

To the person that said that concealed sword is just a big knife
by: Anonymous

A sword is always double edged

Comment below is wrong.
by: Anonymous

I don;t think you have ever owned a sword. Medieval style swords are double edged. But I own five swords, three of which only have a single edge.

Absolutely not
by: B.Miron

You absolutely cannot carry a sword concealed or otherwise in New Jersey. If you are old enough to remember the ferryboat incident then you will know why. There is also the folding knife blade limit of less than 3 inches to keep in mind. The law in Jersey are pretty much the same in New York. You can however transport a sword in a case in your trunk and go from the car to a building and back again but you cannot just carry it around. That's about it. Almost forgot, sword canes are illegal in public as well.

Sword for defense
by: Troll

A dull blade will cut off a limb if it has the right weight in the hands of someone who knows how to use it.
There is nothing...and I mean NOTHING about a sword in this day that makes it even worth considering as a defense weapon. Anyone skilled in the use of one would be able to explain the reasons to you. You carry a sword in public concealed or otherwise and use it to defend yourself and you will be doing time in prison.

Anonymous about all swords double edged
by: Anonymous

Not true, let me name a few of them off that are SINGLE ended only. Backsword, Sabre, Scimitar, Katana, Doa, Messer, Kopis, Faix, Falcata, Flachion, Scyth Sword. Your statement is void.

What you should do
by: Sword fanatic

Buy a sword, machete, knife, ect. But keep it at home or if you go camping/ hiking then take em with you. But for public places you need to think about laws and safety, honestly if you need something for self defense and not a gun or taser, then get a wooden sword inside a sleeve. You won't cut anyone, but you can defend without doing near death damage, if you give ever got hit by a stick then you know it's still effective.

Concealed "Life-Saver"
by: Corr Pendragon

If anyone knows anything about gun laws and self-defense here, which is obvious that most do, You will know that it is completely legal to carry almost any firearm into public areas as long as it is not concealed, but to conceal, one must have a permit and go through a class.

Should it not be similar for swords?

lightnight sparda
by: Angel Ray Hill

I'd rather see people with swords than guns. Illegal guns and legal guns have killed more people in the city than any sword will so for defence perpouse it is legal to carry a sword. Thoughs who appose should consider them shelf on the side of thoughs who rob steal and terrorize the inocence of a provence or community. I'd rather intimidate thoughs who's hidden intent is to harm and harras than be victimized with out meaningful tactical defence.

German and Scottish Great Swords
by: Mengtheman

If the government wasn't scared of large melee weapons.
They would make it legal to carry it around.
There are some stupid criminals who ruin it for lovers of swords and other melee weapons.
That is one reason, why I think we can't carry large melee weapons around in public.
But my neighbors are cool, with me swinging around my razor sharp 64 inch total in length.
48 inch double edged scottish lowlander hero's warsword blade.
Since I am not a threat to them.
I just love the art of the sword.
Of German and Scottish swordsmanship styles.

"unlawful use"
by: Anonymous

One could, perhaps, make the argument that since the law specifies "unlawful use" that one COULD carry a sword for self defense, since (unless the law states otherwise) self defense is a lawful act. However, that is one that your lawyer would probably have to argue in court AFTER you are arrested... :/

Here
by: Zach

Everybody is talking about how you would carry a gun not a knive or sword it would we to hard to hide. But What you could do is carry around some throwing knives.

United Cutlery UC2904 Lightning Bolt Triple Throwing Set:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008OVOE18/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

On swords in public and self defense
by: Ro

Carrying a sword in public will get you in trouble in most places. However, if you're in a special place, it's not completely useless. According to FBI records, knife-wielding attackers usually win against a handgun-wielding defender at a range of 7 yards, which well exceeds the distance most assaults occur within. Knife beats gun. That being said, sword beats knife, yet gun beats sword because it's difficult to conceal and deploy a sword if you're the defender. In the one circumstance it would be practical, which is when you are being held at gunpoint, it would be wiser to use both hands to disarm the opponent and order him to the ground with it.

RazorBaton in place of a sword?
by: Curtis W. Koehler

If a sword is illegal; perhaps a RazorBaton is your answer. (In some states a concealed carry permit covers edged weapons and batons) If you go to www.RazorRazor.com and look at the differences between a concealed BeltSword (The RazorSword carried by some US Special Operations), and compare the RazorSword to the Law Enforcement Baton (RazorBaton). The RazorBaton has no point, with a rounded tip. The RazorBaton compares somewhat to the “nerve stick” used by Eskrima experts; only much better…the RazorBaton is specially tempered - with hardened 1095 high carbon spring steel.

You will have just as much kinetic energy with a RazorBaton as you will have with a RazorSword. Both are totally hidden (in a standard leather belt – but using a steel linked containment system) and are impossible to see. They deploy faster than a concealed carry handgun; both will crush concrete blocks without sustaining any significant edge damage. (Watch videos)

We demo a collapsible baton striking concrete in the videos, and within a few strikes the collapsible baton is broken/useless. From our research; the collapsible baton may lack sufficient kinetic energy to be effective against a powerful committed assailant.

As far as bringing a knife to a gun fight; you cannot outdraw a drawn gun anyway. (It is impossible to make any comment like that until you are in the fray) Studies show us that most people that talk about carrying their handgun; don’t really carry it that often. When I go to the beach (wearing only a pair of shorts); I will carry anything from a 9-inch RazorDagger to a 33-inch RazorBaton…in total concealed comfort. With a web belt I can go swimming – let’s see how a handgun works after that. (You need to carry a weapon 100% of the time!!!)

In some ambush situations you may be better off to take control of your attacker and use an edged weapon. Everyone…Everyone should have some sort of an edged weapon as a back-up. You will not find a military in the world that does not use edged weapons of some sort.

In CQB the Filipino Marines (SOF) prefer the Ginunting sword to a handgun, and use the sword in operations against insurgent groups. http://gonkafied.blogspot.com/2012/08/the-sword-as-weapon-in-modern-combat.html

Making gross generalizations about any weapon, or weapon system is not wise. It all comes down to the situation; however whatever weapon you plan to carry…some practice every day. Training, training, and more training!

Very respectfully, Curtis W. Koehler – creative@wi.rr.com

Prefence
by: Jordan

i think the law should be guns are for hunting and safety of a home. if you want to carry a weapon in public places it should be a sword because its more obvious who had done it visual wise. with a gun people can just shoot and conceal it from view. imagine gangs with swords. not much of a fight if a person can run...with a gun your chance of living doesn't matter your still going to get hurt where as if u ran when a man chases you with a sword you have a chance to survive and if you had a sword for selfdefence then it would be a battle of skill not who can pull a trigger first. guns should be for only 3 uses (police justice, hunting, protecting your home) and swords should be a public defense weapon. if this were to pass I would be so happy id take kendo classes if I can find some so id be prepared to carry a katana around to protect myself but like that one guy sed in court it could be more considered murder than self defence seeing you cut the attacker multiple times

Really?
by: Anonymous

To the guy who talked about gangs carrying around swords and that guns should just be for hunting and protecting the home. I want to think about something, would gangs really follow the law and carry around swords and not guns? NO! That's why their in gangs, they don't care about the law. They'll carry a gun around anyway.

not concealed
by: Anonymous

as long as it is A) securely fastened to the sheath (not easy to take out of sheath or holder) B) not concealed and C) you mustn't respond to anyone in a rude or hostile manner other than were you in a situation where survival dictates pulled loaded gun, un sheathed/ belted weapon etc.

why stop at the sword
by: Anonymous

They have guns now and you have to protect yourself so get a shield for your protection. But why stop there get ninja stars.#SmurfsAreReal

BeltSword Weapon System
by: Curtis W. Koehler

In some states like Wisconsin; you may carry a RazorSword in the BeltSword Weapon System…providing you have a concealed carry permit. Other states mandate only a handgun; while others allow batons, knives, or variants of the Taser, etc.

In Wisconsin it is legal to carry either a concealed RazorSword, or RazorBaton. The RazorBaton is similar to the RazorSword; without a sharp point (The tip has been rounded). The RazorBaton offers some of the same power associated with the RazorSword; but it leans to the politically correct side.

Please read independent tests from US Military, FBI-HRT retired, and counter-terror experts – go to FAQ at www.RazorRazor.com

Very respectfully, Curtis W. Koehler – CEO (Chief Edged Officer)

swords
by: joe

I would rather be a criminal than a corpse/so I carry a knife or two always/ but thats not the issue. The issue has to do with our right to carry swords in public not to slash and cut people with but to carry in a manner not threatening to anyone.
No wonder the law makers ban everything just in case. W.t.f.

Not everything that's sharp is an implement of death and destruction. Anything can potentially kill( even a tampon can kill). Don't ask me how I leave that up to police and law makers. However I do find it funny that a race of killers make all potential weapons, illegal to everyone but themselves for their own convenience.

If your wondering about leagally carying anything look in your pocket's if you can't find the money to pay a fine don't carry anything that police can hang you with
, but if your a criminal do what you want no one cares if you get shot by popo so why should you?

swords
by: joe

Go Zatoichi cops go!!!

Applauding
by: DruidicPeace

This is sage wisdom, especially considering how much false information you have to weed through online. I tip my hat to the writer of this article. Keep up the good work.

Time to get our priorities in order!!!
by: Curtis W, Koehler

According to Paul and DruidicPeace; never bring a sword to a gun fight. But the Philippine Marines prefer a Ginunting short sword to a handgun in CQB – obviously not in all cases. There is no such thing as the perfect weapon; depending upon environment, threat level, and training…it will differ. A SOF buddy of mine stated; "You can never have too many weapons". Two is one and one is none!

Scenario: A thug pulls a large knife intent on killing you; yet behind him is a crowd of innocent people. Are your really going to pull your side arm and "fire for effect"? (Next you are going to tell me that you are good enough to hit your target at 10-20 feet every time - with no risk of hitting the crown behind the perp) My next question is how many confirmed kills do you have, do you train every day, do you recognize that even trained law enforcement go into "autonomic response mode" and keep firing 5, 10, or 15 rounds – that the human body of that perp can absorb multiple handgun rounds, be literally dead after 10-15 hits…yet kill you with an edged weapon before they collapse.

For those that wish to ban concealed carry of swords; at what point does a large concealed knife cross the line to a sword. If you knife is 12-inches does that mean a 12.5-inch knife becomes a sword. Or is 22-inches ok; but a hair over 22-inches becomes a sword. (Let’s ban kitchen knives that are responsible for 80% of all knife murders)

We are developing the RazorMachete; 22-inches to 33-inches in length. It deploys faster than a concealed carry handgun, and can crush concrete blocks. (If anyone doubts this; we will be happy to place a large monetary wager on a competition)

Does this mean that you should not carry a RazorMachete for survival, camping, hiking, or even self-defense? Many women are not comfortable with the use of a handgun; who among us is willing compromise their right for self-preservation. I have plenty of women that carry our RazorSword in lieu of a handgun; especially when they wear tight jeans with no place to hide a firearm.

A blanket statement without the proper orientation to the environment and circumstances is obtuse! Many wish to also ban the AR-15 because of several deadly incidents; however statistically insignificant those events may be. Homicides by rifle (All rifles) in the entire US are traditionally between 200-400 per year…very few with an AR-15. (Many more are killed with handguns in Chicago alone)

What should you really be concerned about…
1. 200,000 gang members in Chicago alone
2. Areas in Chicago (And other major cities) controlled by "terrorist" drug lords
3. The Obama administration declaring open season on Law Enforcement
4. A nuclear Iran, North Korea, Pakistan, and many more
5. Bio weapons that are being developed by many-many countries (No one is talking about this)

Time to get our real priorities in order!!!

Very respectfully, Curtis W. Koehler
Chief Edged Officer (CEO)
RazorRazor.com

the sword that saves lives takes lives
by: Anonymous

In many states that regulate the length of bladed weapons if the limit ex in Ga we have a five inch limit for bladed weapons, that's blade length and not over all length a weapons permit, for 30 dollars exspires in 5 years allows bladed weapons over that length to Be carried both open or other wise. Our ccw just says ''weapon'' generally used to carry hand guns but weapon is a very open ended term. I've asked and large bladed weapons count towards this permit, also No limit to the number of weapons carried or type, ex a sword, dagger, and pistol can Be carried ndr the same permit.

A lot of people will say carring a sword is a crazy or bad idea, I'm not one of them. I've carried a sword for over five years. Been attacked a few times which lead to my carry. I'm here to tell you that since I've carried it No attacks have took place. Most people don't care and some seven thought my katana was ''nice'' or ''cool'' also it has it's uses, I walk in the woods where bursh, vines, and the like are easy work for my katana. Also a lot of people carry sticks pipes, ect I assume for wild dogs, in a fight a sword would Be better than a gun, easier to exsplain to the law ''he came at me with a stick so I shot him'' jail time, ''he came at me with a stick and I let him break it on my sword, it failled so He ran away'' nothing more than their laoghter. One final thought, if you carry a sword either know how to use it or learn. Not knowing will Be worse than not having it. Also just like guns carring it and using it are two differnt things. I use mine in very minamal ways letting you break your stick on it, slapping you with side of blade or it's back. Never cut anyone with it and never had troublebecause of it hope this helps.

Paul who's not a lawyer
by: Jim

Paul, if you have no legal information to offer then why would you respond to a question asking for specific legal advice. Go to the (who gives a shit web site) and listen to yourself talk there! Happy Holidays, Jim

legal weapons similar to swords
by: Astyanaz

The only reason that I ever considered wearing a sword for was style, not self-defense, having never been attacked.
But - has anyone ever considered singlesticks, as was popular in Victorian England. If you could use a sword, you also train with a similarly sized stick and, if needed, use it like a sword. They are very effective. Also, something similar to a bokken, as Musashi used to defeat Kojiro, and for many of his later fights. For either of these, you could use a walking cane or staff, which are much less likely to raise suspicion. Find something that is legal, and learn to use it.

Just sayin'...
by: Anonymous

When laws say "...use unlawfully against another person...", that leaves it open to interpretation by the courts. After all, unless you live in a place that does not allow the carry of weapons for personal defense against criminals (like Canada...), a good defense lawyer could argue that carrying a sword (or other weapon not SPECIFICALLY prohibited by law) for the purpose of defending oneself against violent criminals, is LAWFUL intent, as opposed to carrying it for the express purpose of intimidating or harming INNOCENT people, which would obviously be UNLAWFUL intent. And since, at least in the USA, the accused is deemed to be "innocent until proven guilty", the burden of proof of "unlawful intent" is on the court. Of course, you still have to be put through the wringer of the court system, but maybe if enough people use swords expressly for undeniable, justifiable self defense, and are found "not guilty", it would set a precedent...

Sword Vs Firearm
by: Anonymous

Ok.Marine Corp Veteran here. Let me enlighten all of you on the blade vs gun argument. Show me one instance in history where a military that fields edged.weapons versus one that uses firearms has ever won a battle. Ever. Answer, NEVER. Get yourself firearms training NOW. If you cant own a firearm where you live, MOVE or be prepared fo be a victim. We used tomahawks during CQB in Afghanistan during extremely tight quarters but it was mostly for shock value. Nothing trumps a firearm. period

KleenKut
by: Anonymous

Guys! Sounds as though one shouldn't as much as pass gas (perhaps even in private) in NJ w/o permission. It seems we have allowed unmerited infringement upon far too many of our natural (and Divinely endowed) rights in the USA.

Problems before us now are how to go about rescinding the outrageous infractions and gaining protection for and reinstatement of those which have been compromised or hamstrung.

It may be entertaining and therapeutic for us to complain about the outrage, but isn't it better to seek solutions and reinstatement, as well as protection for our rights? After all, as many have observed, the goons don't give a flip about law or order anyway. Anyone pursuing a course of redress?

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